We launched new forums in March 2019—join us there. In a hurry for help with your website? Get Help Now!
    • 4018
    • 1,131 Posts
    Those are some good points, edge. There’s been some talk recently on whether the branding of Tattoo is good for the business/commercial sector. Honestly, I’m walking the fence on this one. On one hand, the Tattoo name has alot of possibilities in way of look and feel and using the name as a way of symbolizing what it actually does. Plus, the name is simple and quite identifiable on just the name alone. But, on the other hand, there is the risk that if you attempt to pitch it to a business they might look at the name and cringe. Let’s face it, the corporate world is fickle and some business owner might look at the name as a sign of something a bit rebellious...not the sort of image that older folks at corporations really go for. It’s really just a matter of how you present it and how a business owner/manager interprets it...which can be good or bad.

    The real questions we need to ask are this: Do we stick with MODx? Or do we switch to Tattoo? Or do we create two distributions: one called MODx and another called Tattoo? Is this even a good idea? Would we much better off keeping everything under one roof with one name. Furthermore, is it a good idea to even think about creating another name seeing as alot of people already have the name MODx engrained in the membrane? Or, if we change the name to Tattoo, would this ultimately enable us to market it better to all sectors, including the corporate market?

    We need to really consider it all and go with the answer that makes the most sense and, in the end, is the solution that will best further the project. What this means is that we really need to think in terms of what is best for the project.
      Jeff Whitfield

      "I like my coffee hot and strong, like I like my women, hot and strong... with a spoon in them."
    • General Motors: Chevrolet, Cadillac, Saturn, Hummer, GM...

      Ford: Ford, Lincoln, Mercury, Saab, Jaguar, Rover...

      Mercedes: Mercedes, Jeep, Chrysler, Dodge, and more...
        Ryan Thrash, MODX Co-Founder
        Follow me on Twitter at @rthrash or catch my occasional unofficial thoughts at thrash.me
        • 14267
        • 113 Posts
        I started to write about the idea of double branding, thinking it might be a dumb idea. But from what Jeff and Ryan just posted, I’m thinking it might not be so dumb. After all it’s just the sort of thing Modx itself could run with two templates and a plugin. Of course you couldn’t completely hide the fact that it’s a double brand, but would you need to?
          • 1764
          • 680 Posts
          I don’t want to get too deep into this one at this point (been there done that smiley ). But I will say that I don’t think that MODx is a very good name honestly.

          Any name sounds good once you’ve heard it enough, and to those of us here the name has a good connotation because of our good experiences with MODx. Heck even the name Hoary Hedgehog sounds fine to me I’ve hard it so much.

          MODx was given it’s name because it was originally a mod and that’s probably the first thing that people think when they hear the name. And adding an X to a name seems a bit 90’s to me personally.

          I can also understand that Tattoo has a negative conotation to a lot of people. I don’t honestly like the name Tattoo in and of itself but I do like a lot of the potential associations, tag lines and other things it provides.
            • 3022
            • 59 Posts
            With all respect: I think double branding is not wise. It’s confusing.

            a LOT of effort, thought, debate and justification has gone into what’s going to be revealed in the near future. It’ won’t please everyone, but that’s OK, because no one is paying us to do this stuff full time. smiley
            Even if I am not fond of the name Tattoo, Ryan has a strong point here. It IS a lot of work to find a name. And as someone who has put a lot of time into this beautifull CMS, he has a very strong voice.

            On one hand, the Tattoo name [...] using the name as a way of symbolizing what it actually does.
            I don’t follow this one... huh


            One can turn it into a little joke when presenting this to an company or government audience: "Don’t ask me why they call this system Tattoo, but it is a great CMS! Let me show you...".

            Anyway, if Tattoo is the new name, Tattoo is the new name. I will use this great system whatever it is called.

            BTW, I am very glad Tattoo doesn’t have a pathetic exclamation sign (!) at the end! grin


            Bee
              • 32241
              • 1,495 Posts
              I won’t debate over this. It seems to me that everything had been planned by the core team, and I won’t go deeper into persuading anything to have a different name. My only concer that I would like to know is the real meaning behind the name.

              Ever since the Tattoo is under development, it will be great to know the reason behind choosing this name, as well as the real meaning behind the name itself.

              As far as double branding goes, I see quite a lot of negative impact, but in terms of what I know about our system, I don’t think it will hurt us, ever since the development of Tattoo will be targeting a different market and people. (hope I’m not assuming something wrong here.)
                Wendy Novianto
                [font=Verdana]PT DJAMOER Technology Media
                [font=Verdana]Xituz Media
                • 1764
                • 680 Posts
                Quote from: BeeStar at Feb 03, 2006, 06:29 PM

                BTW, I am very glad Tattoo doesn’t have a pathetic exclamation sign (!) at the end! grin

                Well that’s good because Tattoomla! was our second choice tongue
                  • 32319
                  • 129 Posts
                  Quote from: Bravado at Feb 03, 2006, 04:27 PM

                  On one hand, the Tattoo name has alot of possibilities in way of look and feel and using the name as a way of symbolizing what it actually does.

                  I know I am new here and I don’t mean to barge in and rock the boat but I have to say that I don’t really see how the name Tattoo applies to what it actually does. To me, Tattoo sounds like skinning software and while that is one of the front end functions of MODx, it is, at least to me, one of the least interesting or powerful features.

                  On the other hand, maybe it does not matter anyway. One of the things I need in a CMS is the ability to make it invisible to the user. An example of the corporate attitude of many of my clients is that when I do a site for them I am not aloud to put any of my information on the site, even the "author" is listed as the company name, not my name. This is a condition that is spelled out up front. Following that line of thought, I would need to customize the look of the manager and brand it in line with their company. If I think of it like PHP, the client does not really need to know that I am using PHP and in the end there is no physical sign that the foundation of the site is built on it.

                  I noticed that a feature is being talked about where there will be more skinning available for the manager and I plan to make ample use of that feature for this very reason.

                  I think in some respects that what I like about the name MODx is exactly what many of you don’t like about it. It means nothing and it is almost invisible. I could therefore be pretty safe in leaving in more of its branding than if the name goes to Tattoo. "Powered by MODx" sounds kinda techie and mysterious. Like it is a core technology, not a out of box software product. MODx is in a similar name style to PHP and MySQL. They don’t mean a thing to non users.

                  On the subject of double brand, maybe instead of thinking of it like a double brand from a marketing perspective maybe it could be an "Infinite Brand"™ where part of skinning the manager would allow for you to define a new name for the application. Because it is a behind the scenes app, there would be very little effect on general marketing and would be an amazing feature for people like me who need the appearance of a customized/personalized solution.

                  Will the name Tattoo be a deal breaker for me? No, of course not. MODx/Tattoo is awesome and I will use it no mater what its name is as long as it is servicing my needs. Will the name Tattoo ever grow on me. No, it won’t I am not a big fan of Tattoos though so it is a personal bias. Plenty of people love Tattoos.

                  Anyway, think about the idea of "Infinite Branding". Not only does it sound like a cool buzz word it would be a totally friggin awesome feature that would be extremely helpful for people like me. And, from what I have seen from the way MODx works, it probably would not be too difficult to implement, especially as you dig through the code to replace MODx with Tattoo.

                  EDIT: Fixed a few spelling mistakes...
                    "Regret for the things we did can be tempered by time; it is regret for the things we did not do that is inconsolable."
                    -- Sydney Harris
                    • 6726
                    • 7,075 Posts
                    Waow, I see passion is in the air !
                    Great debate smiley

                    I think Tattoo is a great name, and has lot of potential the first one being symbolism. People not liking it will quickly forget their dislike when they just test-run the system ! (Whitefen has a lot of good points here)

                    Personnally, I like the hint of "rebellious" symbolism associated with "Tattoo". Like Whitefen, I am not wearing tattoos, and don’t particularly like them. But it says "we have strong identities, and are not afraid to wear our differences publicly". And I like that. Especially since we are different from the classical CMS/CMF...

                    Strangely, my "concern" about branding will go to MODx, not Tattoo. It’s not that I don’t like the name, but rather its ties to Etomite, and its containing the "mod" word. MODx is so much more than an Etomite mod ! The way I see it, I even think we should change the name when the manager is overhauled... but as Whitefen underlines, the name is not really a "blocker" in any case. It’s just a personnal point of view here...

                    As far as double branding goes, I don’t agree, I don’t think this would be a problem as far as the two brands target different market segments...
                      .: COO - Commerce Guys - Community Driven Innovation :.


                      MODx est l'outil id
                      • 28150
                      • 155 Posts
                      I originally liked several of the names we had thought about using before, nd Tattoo always left a sour taste. That being said, I’m not necessarily an advocate of ANY name change.

                      For the past year, we have established MODx as a unique brand in and of itself. Changing the name now in a sea full of other CMSes will just further confuse people.

                      Personally, I think that the MODx name should be adopted, the branding be redone for it and launched as it is already known.

                      This discussion is closed to further replies. Keep calm and carry on.