IMHO - You need better themes!

We have revolution loaded and actually use it for one of our internal portals to store information, but have been reluctant to use it with our clients at this stage because of its lack of readily available themes etc.
We look at this site with its great layout, menus, java script goodies etc etc, then we load up revolution, download all the available themes (which I think totals 26), and check them out for a good base to learn from or start with. They are basically the same square box layout, 2 column with a basic menu along the top. None really are a good starting point for anything beyond a basic blog etc.
Don’t get me wrong, I understand the work and effort put in and, for some, they are quite reasonable for a bare bones site but really do not show off anything of what modx seems to be capable of.
For example we tried Joomla, and even though its too bloated and slow for what we required, it came ready packaged with themes that showed off its capabilities. Decent menus, a bit of javascript animation, seperate content areas, banner display, animations etc etc . If nothing else by changing a few images, a bit of CSS it offered a good base to start developing a site around.
The same goes for CMS like Concrete5, CMS made simple etc etc.
A good indication of a CMS is generally their home page. You download, and setup the CMS and it generally looks like a basic version of their homepage.
You check out modx and come across a wonderful site that is a tribute to the CMS itself but then when you download modx revolution and load it up and see either nothing but a blank page, or a theme that comes from the dark ages of the original modx. Not very inviting, especially for the non tech user.
I know some developers prefer to start with nothing, but part of modx’s attraction to me as a learning site developer is its versatility and open architecture, but I also find it frustrating to initially setup and layout in regards to the theme. After many trial and errors I managed to get a javascript carousell to work, and a basic tab system etc etc. The problem being that I have nothing to start with, as a guide. (The tutorials helped a little.)
I’d love to see a template that is similar to your own site, with a decent menu system, and the carousell , and banner system, side bars etc etc. Show off the capabilities.
Even basic themes like the basic 3 column, header footer with decent menu system.
A little more inviting to the new comer, and a good base to start with.

This is definitely something that some people are working on..

The problem (or blessing) is though, we don’t have a weird templating mechanism. We just have a textfield where you tell the system what to output. No restrictions, weird terms or php - just HTML and dynamic content through simple tags.

You could go to themeforest or any template site and integrate that into MODX easily with addons available, as well as core features in no more than a few hours depending on the complexity.

I fully agree in that modx is reasonably friendly when it comes to some themes, and I am slowly learning the idea of converting some, but again I have found it does take a bit of learning to utilise many aspects, such as the tags and snippets etc
A lot is by trial and error but generally I can get a basic template going. Menus and other tricks are always the problem, hence its good to have a working base to start with.

OK here is an idea, I want to learn about building transport packages next. I’ve used PackMan to package a group of snippets together that I use on most sites, but this won’t package resources. So if someone finds an existing template some where that shows off some of the stuff ProgramIT is talking about I’m happy to convert it to MODx (Might even document the process) then use it to learn about packaging and release it so long as the original licence lets us.

I think you’re asking for two different things.

1. Plug and play collections of templates, CSS, files and other MODX gubbins which demonstrate the full flexibility of MODX - which means Extras and template variables. Both of these need resources (and resource ids, in particular) to work properly. This is actually quite hard to achieve, and why the Sample Site package, for example, wipes your resource database on install - so that everything works as expected.

2. Skins - ie CSS, JS and image files. Personally, I prefer working with frameworks, but there are at least two HTML5 boilerplate templates knocking about on the forums and it really isn’t that hard to take ANY other theme or template and make it MODX. That’s kind of the point of the system. Take a visual representation of data (or ’view’, as Jason prefers) or as most mortals would understand ’a page template’, cut it into blocks and work decide which way to populate those blocks using MODX. The kicker being that there’s usually three ways of populating that block, and no ’best’ solution some of the time.

I think people don’t install the MODX sample site often enough. If you’re a newbie - that’s your sandbox install. Poke around with it, have a look at how the most common packages fit together, then reinstall a clean Revo. Similarly, it might help folks if designers did some alternate CSS representations for the sample site package - as that’s a little closer to how WP works for theme previewing, and is a lot simpler to achieve. If and when I get my arse in gear and start writing some MODX tuts, that will be one of the first.

You can take any HTML template off http://themeforest.net/ and convert it into a fully managed MODX template in short order. That being said, you’re absolutely right about having awesome template examples being available. That should start to go away later this year.

I guess there would be some benefit to having ready to go themes for learning how to template, but IMHO getting the HTML/CSS template you want and then porting it to MODx yourself is the best way to go. There are so many ways to get things done, and to utilize the available snippets or roll your own that it makes sense to me to do it myself so I can customize my implementations. Using ready to install templates sort of ties you to how the person who ported it implemented things, and I feel I then have to go in and dig around to figure their implementation out in order to make changes.

That said, I am not opposed to the idea. I just feel it sort of defeats the flexibility MODx gives you in terms of themeing.

Just my 2c.

I totally agree with everything Mary says here.

Maybe have one system as a good example? But having an entire built in theme system with all the scaffolding that goes with that could mean that this project might start to resemble Wordpress, and I am not sure that is a good thing...

Quote from: Photowebmax at Apr 03, 2011, 07:11 PM

I totally agree with everything Mary says here.

Maybe have one system as a good example? But having an entire built in theme system with all the scaffolding that goes with that could mean that this project might start to resemble Wordpress, and I am not sure that is a good thing...

Of course MODx is not WordPress, but not everyone who starts to use MODx is a developer or is familiar with PHP, HTML and CSS. An out of the box solution would obviously appeal to a wider audience, but as pointed out that may not be a good thing for various reasons. On the other hand, I think that a lot of small businesses with limited budgets, work-at-home moms and professional bloggers would love to get their hands on an easy-to-use 100% customizable alternative to WordPress and Joomla.

What are the options for website owners, dreamers or even startups these days? You can do it yourself if you have the skills (or the time to learn them), you can install a solution like Joomla or Drupal, or you can pay a developer. MODx offers a fourth option - a 100% customizable solution almost anyone can use if they take the time to read a little and experiment. What is needed are a few packages, pre-built for different scenarios. To name a few: A blog, a web shop, a company site, a community, club or membership site, a religious site and a news/magazine/sports website, along with 2 or 3 themes for each.

Such options would give anyone more adventurous than your average Joomla, Drupla, or WordPress user a solid foundation to start with and learn from. From there they can customize to their hearts content. A Twitter clone? A Flippa or Fiverr clone? The possibilities are awesome!

Mary is right, but only if the user actually want to learn MODx.
Fact is that some user just want keys in hand websites that just work even if it is not a lot customized.

What would be the issue if a blog component come with a way similar to WP (with sidebar default html/blaock wrapper, and a chunk structure imposed to allow easy theme switch) ?
Basic users would be able to buy premade theme one year and change it later at their own will without having to learn MODx.
Advanced users would be able to continue to use MODx as they do now without losing one inch of flexibility.

Maybe that the old guard is afraid to lose something here.
I see larger audience and a more accessible tool. MODx is great, but it seriously needs leverage.

That being said, the most blocker point that i encounter for MODx usage is the fact that components are in database by default instead of filesystem.
But that’s another story :p