MODx vs. Wordpress vs. Joomla

For me trackbacks and pings are one of reasons I still use WP. I have thought that if I had time I would try and build and entire WP system on MODx (I have joked I would build the Kubrick based theme for MODx just for giggles) but I am going to wait until 097 is stable and the custom builds stuff gets documented.

On a side-note, has anyone in this thread gotten MODx to use Trackbacks or pinging?

Well, I guess I’ll dig into it and let you know. This link is probably a good start:

http://www.earn-web-cash.com/2008/01/08/how-to-write-a-php-script-to-send-a-trackback/

Good article. I never stopped to think about the way trackbacks work, interesting.

That should be pretty easy to automate; have a Trackback TV that’s nothing more than a field for entering the trackback URI, and a plugin that will gather the data from the page and fire off the trackback when the page is saved if there is a legal URI in the TV. Might be a good idea for the plugin to empty the TV before the actual save, too, so that there won’t be any accidents if the document is edited.

Hi,
I’ll just add a couple thoughts here because I’m one of those odd people who likes MODx and Wordpress equally, and I have quite a bit of experience with both, having put together over a dozen sites with each. So this note isn’t trying to convert MODx zealouts, who will always think it’s better. It’s for someone shopping who might be trying to compare them.

I’ve recently run into requests that could not easily be met by either, so I’ve been doing a lot of CMS "shopping". MODx is still young, so some things are in their budding stages. Like documentation.

But MODx wins hands-down over anything I’ve seen with ease of templating. That is its single strongest feature for me. And this includes being able to use Template Variables to cram just about anything you want into a page. I’ve been able to do things that are quite complex to the point of bizarreness with TV’s. Extremely good. Also, the Wayfinder menu builder is a killer app once you figure out its parms and can handle CSS to fill in the gaps. And as a framework, MODx is massively customizable, if you’re willing to write and edit code.

Yet Wordpress has its charms. There are loads more developers, so if you say to yourself, "I wonder if WP can do so-and-so" there’s a pretty good chance someone has done it. A good example is that there’s a form builder that is extremely customizable, and will automagically make database fields if you want more than just email. And it’s constantly being updated and improved. It’s Ajax, so you can visually build your form without touching any code at all. Yes, you can build forms fine with MODx, but it’s a lot more manual labor, especially if you want database fields.

And even though the WP templating might be somewhat more tricky, you have billions of free themes all over that you can easily edit. And the CSS editing is easily done through the interface.

WP’s backend admin system is just upgraded and easier than ever. I create sites with it and don’t even bother to train the client to use it, and they don’t even ask. MODx Manager is nearly there, but not quite.

WP also has an auto-update figure for plug-ins that’s extremely handy. And it can tell you if a plug-in is updated.

At the risk of making a gross generalization, I’d still say that right-brainers will prefer Wordpress, and left-brainers will prefer MODx. Yes, this comment will annoy people. But I think it’s largely true. An example would be that a right-brainer would not tend to be handling databases, writing applications, and other stuff that nerdy MODx does so very well. So the right-brainer wouldn’t need any of that, and could get a nice simple site up faster using Wordpress.

I have less experience with Joomla, but I agree with the comment below that it’s very restictive. I was asked to try to customize some things in it, and it’s terrible trying to get under the hood, at least from the backend admin. There’s a constant balance between having something massively customizable, like MODx is, and having an idiot-proof, fault-tolerant interface. Joomla has gone the inflexible idiot-proof method, IMHO. Joomla does, however, offer a lot of fancy plug-ins, and has a giant user base. Many plug-ins are not free, but if you’re paying for something, it’s often possible to get better support.

Hope that helps someone.
Samba

I think that’s a very fair assessment Samba; thanks for sharing.

@Samba

That is a great set of points. I still can’t get away from Wordpress for Blogging there are just to many feature perfect addons to ignore as well MODx is killer for building out custom sites as you say. I don’t think that a balanced MODxer will deny that both work and work well. MODx is not a WP killer nor is WP 2.5.x a CMS killer.

The right tool for the project/client

Thanks for your thoughts.

Cheers,

Jay

Jay is right here and I share his point of view, and most of the web professionnal skill is first and foremost advising on which tools fits the needs better...

Back on the right / left brainer thingy : don’t get me started on this, I have a long enduring passion for neuro-sciences... I sure could argue to the opposite of what you say, I have been profiled as a right brainer and I must say that I clicked with MODx very fast and never clicked with WordPress. Now the form builder you’re talking about seems very right brainer, kind of eForm with an AJAX GUI  

Evidently, no one is all right or left brain and we both use each part of our brain preferentially depending on the issue at hand. We develop cognitive patterns over time, and we tend to stick with those... But, hey, it all depends what we’re talking about... if you take templating sure MODx is right-brainer and WordPress with it’s analytical PHP is rather left brainer. Mostly, designers are rather right brainers and coders left brainers but then again it would be oversimplifying because everyone is a combination/balance of both (that’s not adding the cortical/limbic balance in the mix ). OO programming has a more holistic approach and fits right brainer probably better than left brainer while procedural is the opposite (or at least, that’s what I think).

Told you not to get me started on this ! Keep in mind this is all simplifications (as all classification system) and we’re far from knowing everything about the brain... after all there are more potential combination in the brain than atoms in the universe !!!

Back to MODx vs Joomla vs WordPress : you sure made good and valid points here and I mostly agree with what you say except I think MODx can attract various profiles and not only coder types   I don’t think snippet calls are very hard to fathom, they’re pretty intuitive actually. It’s a simple syntax allowing me to do powerful things I am pretty much totally unable to code myself. It connects well with the "designer’s logic" and paradigm : tags, parameters and the cognitive pattern here is very similar to html/xhtml. It’s fast to learn, easy to use.

That’s probably why MODx has been so exciting for me from day one : it allows me to customize not only the looks but the logic while not being able to write any significant PHP ! And I am not even talking of TVs which give me custom data structure and the ability to use it as I see fit without coding a line of PHP 

Now back on WordPress : it’s a great blogging tool and for really advanced blogging I’d use it over any other system for sure (though the french DotClear - especially 2.x - has pretty good capabilities with a nicer template system). Joomla ? Forget it I’ll never oh never use this but hey my business is selling custom websites not volumes of standardized websites and I am sure biased (sorry, I had to troll a bit but I really believe it to be true).

Don’t get *ME* started.

[OT Rant] There’s essentially no actual empirical evidence that *anyone* is either left or right brained in spite of the zillions of misguided articles and posts on the topic.

People with an intact corpus callosum use both halves of their brains all the time. There’s no evidence that one side is more developed than the other in so-called left and right brainers, nor do those people show any more electrictal activity on one side than the other as compared to their opposites. If you ask people to draw something, you will see more activity on the right side of the brain. The level of activity and lateralization is equal for mathematicians and artists. If you ask people to read a difficult sentence, you’ll see more activity on the left side and, again, the level of activity and lateralization is equal for mathematicians and artists.

Not to mention the millions of people who, like myself are good and bad at some supposed left and right brainer activities. For example, I have a good friend whose skill set looks look like this:

Left
Math - Sucks
Language - Excellent
Logic - Excellent

Right
Art - Sucks
Music - Excellent
Creative writing - Excellent
Visual Recognition - Excellent
Wholistic thought - Average

Is my friend left or right brained? Neither. Like the rest of us, he is "both brained."

If you look at the history of the whole left/right brain discussion, you’ll see that there were a number of experiments with split-brain patients (people who had their corpus callosum’s severed for medical reasons) by Roger Sperry and Michael Gazzaniga and their associates. These experiments found differences in the specializations of the two hemispheres in most individuals -- (e.g. the left hemisphere in most people is better at language and the right is better at art). This is widely accepted.

The next step, however, was the creation of the notion that *individuals* could be either left or right brained. This idea was created out of thin air by people who were unemployed or tired of their day jobs and wanted to become highly-paid consultants/authors on the topic of right and left brain thinking. None of these people had any real background in neuroscience. Nor did they look too closely at the existing evidence. If they had, they would have seen that not only is there no legitimate research supporting this notion, there are a number of well-designed studies showing it to be absolutely false.

It’s a depressing sign of the failure of modern science reporting that the bogus consultants/writers have been so successful in spreading this scientifically vacant but attractive theory.
[/OT Rant]

(I warned you)

:)

We’re not saying different only you went way further into it than I did, and as you say there are differences in most individuals and hemispheres are specialized. We also agree that we use all parts of our brain, just that we develop preferences and that in this or that context we will use this or that pattern most of the time.

Right/left brain is not supposed to explain everything and as any simplification if you’re not aware of the fact it’s a simplification you’re bound to see it as the reality of how the brain works. But look closely and you’ll see that we tend to simplify all the time, to process the huge amount of information we constantly process.

Let’s take words for instance, it’s a well known gimmick of communication seminars to teach you that people will frequently assume other people have the same understanding of words that they do. Same goes for visual input, who has not gone through the exercise where you get shown a picture which can be read two ways. Some people will see the old lady, some the young lady, some (rare) will see both (check this if you never heard of it). There are other more disturbing illusions, like the Bruner and Postman experiment in 1949 with a tweaked deck of cards containing incongruency like red spades. Results are really interresting.

Being aware that your perceptions are not the reality might seem obvious, but it’s not and understanding others and being a good communicator is trying to understand what the other’s perception is based on a good understanding of one own’s perception... ah but we’re definitely off topic there !!!