IE9 Compatibility

I'm starting to think I'm the only one who's perfectly content (most of the time) using IE9 instead of FF or some other overrated browser.

I'm not saying IE9 is superor - I won't start that fight - but I'm one of those people who finds it sleeker, smoother and generally a little more 'prompt' than the others. I use FF as a backup and if I'm honest I often have to fall back to FF for compatibility reaons, which consistenly frustrates me.

Getting to the point: I've used Evo 0.9.3 - 1.0.5, Revo 2.0.1 - 2.2.0 and the most consistent thing is that it blows chunks in IE9. The issues I get are effectively random, though consistent for a given version.

For example, I have to run Evo 1.0.5 in IE8 Standards mode else the Insert/Edit image popup doesn't work consistently, nor sometimes the HTML editor window, and more recently it seems the calendar dropdowns for publishing resources don't work in IE9 mode.

In Revo, 2.2.0, all the UI buttons are MASSIVE and don't fit in the side bar. In this case, the 'purge deleted documents' button was completely hidden. There are other fundamental issues which aren't springing to mind as I write this. Save to say, I can only go so far before I'm forced to use FF. In Evo I can get by with IE8 standards mode but in Revo I've concluded it's unusable.

Is it just me?

I've also noticed that this forum is considerably broken in IE9, too. I'm fairly sure everything I've got is vanilla. I don't use any strange settings. I'm a bit of a freak like that, actually.

I am pretty sure (it was in the past) due to extjs (the javascript framework used for the modx manager) not working with IE
I believe extjs 4 is meant to be better but there is a lot of work involved in updating from 3 to 4

Don't know enough about it to lay blame though given that the manager works fine with Opera, FF, Chrome, and Safari my money would be with IE being the problem.

As to the forums looking strange with IE9 I have no idea

- well I was intrigued so I investigated a little - using the 'Check Syntax' of BBEdit on the source for this page I found a bunch of errors, most don't matter but two were a missing /div tags and an extra /div tag and looking at the code I think there are more div errors, and other errors...

In this case IE9 might be doing things correctly and my browser (Safari at this moment) may be guessing (correctly?) as to the intended code.

Well it certainly seems odd to me. Are there really so few IE users in the modx community that nobody else is bothered? I suppose on one side of my argument there's the concern that modx alienates a large number of users who'd find it extremely inconvenient to not be able to use their preferred browser, or to be forced to user another one just for modx. But on the other hand, perhaps there are so FEW affected individuals that there simply isn't a loud enough call to have this fixed/improved.

It just seems such an unlikely plight. But it's also the thing about MS vs Apple. IE is in a unique position in that if the majority of a developer community are Mac-based, IE is of absolutely no concern to them, where FF and others *are* used on Macs. FF and Opera have the common ground.

The whole affair pisses me off because I really have no good reason to want to change to another browser. I don't feel the need to switch just because it makes me feel warm and fuzzy inside when I exert power of my PC. I'm a confident user and quite frankly IE works better in Windows 7 than any other I've seen to date. Taskbar thumbnails for tabs, for instance. FF just doesn't support 'em and I have no idea why because they're extremely useful, though not entirely without drawbacks.

Right now my opinion of such things is that I am a Windows user with no interested in OSx, but I also don't have anything AGAINST Apple, or OSx, just as I have nothing against FF or Chrome. But I also don't see ANY greener grass on the other side, much less any compelling reasons to switch to another system, much less another browser. Is there really so much disdain for IE[9] that modx will never work with it?

Is it really so hard to use FF or Chrome - it is a good idea to check your web work on several browsers in any case!

I use OS X (I'm not suggesting you should switch) and to check pages can use Opera, FF, Chrome, iCab and running in VirtualBox IE7, IE8, IE9 on XP or Windows7

The forum looking incorrect is an error in the html code:
I think it is a div that is opened inside the <aside> tag and closed outside of it
And an extra </div> just before the footer

Should I find reason enough to switch, I have nothing against the idea in and of itself. But it pains me, a little, to be forced to make an uncomfortable decision based on logic dictated by a loud minority who invent reasons to prefer other software. It seems to me that many people, advanced users or technophobes, choose to use alternative browsers because it makes them feel they have an element of control over their PC. Some people seem to derive pride from knowing that have control over the prime software they use from day to day, despite the fact it's relatively simple stuff in the grand scheme.

As I think I said before, my main aim is remain open-minded and accept the fact that FF and Chrome are ALSO perfectly good browsers. They may have advantages I've yet to discover, or be told about. But that doesn't change the fact that there are more IE users (all versions, total). Perhaps if you only include developers those stats would be quite different. But so far nobody has EVER presented a genuine reason for ANYONE to stop using IE9. All claims are anecdotal, and in any case I find IE9 a smoother experience, except when software developed by [typically] Apple users fails to support it sufficiently, for reasons I can entirely understand.

As you said, I do in fact use FF as a backup, and for testing. I'm often forced to use FF to get by, when using both modx AND WordPress (occasionally, thought the latest version seems to be ok). Both are developed by people who tend to make tutorials and marketing videos on Macs.

I may be entirely wrong, but it seems fairly likely there are plenty of developers out there who use IE. As I'm the only one whining about it, perhaps that's a sign that everyone else who's concerned couldn't care less. I suppose that's reason enough to ignore IE support. But if there are others with the same plight they should speak up, because it might hurt excellent projects like modx if support for obvious software is neglected.

First, apologies for my whining and the length of this post. Again. It's all for the good of modx - not to piss anybody off.

I had to upload this attachment using FF because IE wouldn't have it.

It's a screenshot I took which illustrates the seemingly unnecessary [and inferior] differences I've spotted while using IE, as compared to Firefox.

For those who are less likely to take a look before I elaborate, I'll list them in the order they're marked ont he image, left to right:

1) The resource tree toolbar is either using different background images for the buttons, or is dependent on some very odd script which happens to render differently. I can't imagine why this toolbar would look so different on two different browsers. Like buttons, this toolbar just looks... less good in IE. See #3 below.

2) There's some kind of dropshadow on the main menu text which doesn't render in IE. I imagine that's some javascript library issue as mentioned in a post above. Seems overly complex for basic menu labels, especially on a menu bar which seems to be the least attractive part of the entire interface. I mean no offense to the one who made it.

3) Back to the resource tree toolbar: because the icons/buttons appear larger in IE, they don't all fit on. More concerning is the fact that the 'remove deleted resources' button is completely absent, and doesn't even reappear if one stretches that pane to be wide enough.

4 & 6) TV category tabs look utterly rubbish is IE, using a completely different background image and no appropriately highlighting the selected tab, background or label.

5) Not a huge difference here. No dropshadow on the button label, but also less curvy corners on the buttons. I suppose that's a javascript issue again.

7) In IE the green tabs on top of the resource tree pane and the main pane look ok. Less good but ok. Select one, however and the tab should turn white. Instead IE just changes the label colour to grey and background remains green. Looks worse, seems unnecessary. Why are tabs and buttons so complicated!? I forgot to mark on the image that at the right edge of every menu there's an extra line which shouldn't be there. A little messy.

8 ) All the 'Save', 'Duplicate' etc. buttons look worse in IE.

I suppose, having thought it through, if all these buttons are dependent on some javascript library to create round-cornered boxes that might explain why IE is unable to render them the same way, given that there's some javascript issue going on. But in any case, perhaps some attention could be paid to some simple CSS for IE users.

I don't mean to come across as an ungrateful whiner. I LOVE modx and plan to more actively support it in future. I see this as part of that support - I aim to raise awareness of things which are unnecessarily poor in an affort to help improve modx. I know this is all rather unimportant on the grand scale, but I've just fallen victim to another few IE related bugs, and having wasted an entire evening chasing my tail only to realise all is well in FF I can't help but feel frustrated and slightly insulted that modx has no love for IE.

If I didn't know better - and I think I do - I might have thought someone was actually going out of their way to make IE look bad. I really do think, however, that no matter how much or little I use modx on various projects, every time I end up concluding that the manager is UNUSABLE in IE. Perhaps that's an exaggeration - I've done quite a lot with it. But every single time I've tripped over at least one thing which simply can't be done using IE, and several more things which are unnecessarily rough.

I've no doubt these issues still persist simply because nobody in the dev team uses IE enough to know about it. Hence my whining, I s'pose. Just raising awareness...

That is all. I think. [ed. note: davidsmith last edited this post 12 years, 1 month ago.]

I suppose, having thought it through, if all these buttons are dependent on some javascript library to create round-cornered boxes that might explain why IE is unable to render them the same way, given that there's some javascript issue going on. But in any case, perhaps some attention could be paid to some simple CSS for IE users.

Don't think its 'some javascript library' causing the problem - in fact using javascript is one way out the browser difference mess.
For example it seems that IE9 has a different take on box-shadow than FF, Chrome, Opera and Safari - see http://stackoverflow.com/questions/5982687/css3-box-shadow-blur-in-ie9 for a short discussion and possible fixes. I'll refrain from a rant!

Rounded corners, shadows and the like are nice but not essential for a manager - my usual attitude on this is to do it right (the html and css) and unless functionality is effected not worry about the differing renderings - I think in this case this is borne out by this:

I decided to look into the tab not turning white since this does impact on the use of the manager (the text does change color but it does make it harder to see what tab is active).
step 1:
using Safari developer tools (Chrome's, or Firebug, or whatever Opera calls their tools would have also worked) I inspected the tab, - the tab is white because it has a class of "x-tab-strip-active" and is targeted by css "background-color: #FBFBFB !important;"
This seems like pretty straight forward css - so lets fire up IE9 and see what is up

step 2:
Look at the page with IE9 - fire up the developer tools scan the code - IE9 is seeing the !important but is ignoring it, look further up the code I find a custom IE filter to create a color gradient for the tabs - deselect it and the tabs are now a solid color, a little less 'pretty' and the active tab is white a big improvement.

So by trying to make things look the same in all browsers and get a gradient on the tabs a simple css effect is broken and a much more important part of the UI is destroyed, because it seems that IE9 considers its filters more important than css !important.


OK I've spent far too much time researching and creating this post and have other work to do so I'm not going to pursue this further.

I do think you could create a bug report for the non white active tab ( reference this thread so someone does not have to repeat my efforts) and for any other usability issues for IE9



[ed. note: whistlemaker last edited this post 12 years, 1 month ago.]

Well I should thank you for your efforts, and I appreciate the time you've spent looking into it.

Hopefully this thread has drawn some attension to these issues from the powers that be. I'd certainly be happier with a simple, gradient-free UI that actually works across the board.