How to best deal with a clients 'vision'

Hello all,

I have a client who wants an online magazine created. He REALLY wants it to look like a magazine and keeps providing me examples of Flash based sites that utilize the oh so loved page flip. However none of these sites have selectable text, they don’t seem SEO friendly at all, nor do they render on an iPhone or iPad which is a goal of my client.

I have tried every argument I can think of to try to convince him that going the Flash route will ultimately limit him and drive up development costs. What are everyone’s thoughts on this? He says all my mockups look too much like a web site and he wants it to look and emulate a print magazine.

I would ditch the client!
Seriously, if you’re not into Flash or you’re not happy doing what he wants advise him to find a developer who doesn’t care if the project is successful or not and is happy to do anything for the money. You’re the professional and you’re telling him his approach is wrong or inadvisable - if he’s not wanting to listen then he is either stupid or does not value your input, in which case why are you working for him? You’ll only end up developing a site you’ll never be happy with, and he’ll come back bitching that it’s getting low search engine throughput and you’re the one that ends up looking like you can’t develop a search engine friendly site. Whats worse is he’ll tell his mates and colleagues that the site you developed for him is a flop which will only further harm your business.

Personally I only do sites which I’m happy doing - if I feel uncomfortable I tell the client (nicely of course ) to look elsewhere for a developer. "I’m too busy and not taking on any new jobs at present" seems to work well.... I spent too many years trying to be everything to every client and it got me nowhere, Now I’m more choosy and the result is my business is a damn site better and I’m enjoying it again.

Thats my two cents. I’ll be interested to know if others agree of if I’m just an SOB!

Thanks, you have a pretty vaild point only I broke a cardinal rule of running your own biz by working with a buddy of mine. He received funding and came to me first for development. Am I off base though in my thinking? I really think that if he wants a site that is viewable on many platforms/devices that Flash is not the way to go. Granted I understand I’ll have to create several skins but that’s not bad really. I do that now with clients. It’s the whole "I want it to look like a print magazine"...

I don’t get it. I’m not anti-Flash I just think it has it’s purpose and crating an entire Flash site solely to match the look of a pageflip is unnecessary.

Let me add one thing: as my ’day job’ I currently am a Producer for Mens Health Magazine online so I know a bit about both worlds. My friend/client just has this image stuck in his head of a virtual magazine down to the page turns and I feel that if I had some assurance that my thinking was sound I could further push my point.

Give him Steve Jobs’ phone email...

Just kidding. I think your instincts are spot on. Google "is Flash dead" or words to that effect and I am sure you will find all kinds of arguments and details on this issue.

It all boils down to this: the guy came to you for council. Your advice is not to build a Flash site. With all the new devices coming on line this is a dawn of a new era. I think you need to articulate your position clearly but also indicate this includes "if you insist then you need to seek other resources" and move on. Say this in a way that says "this is part of my professional service/council."

You could also research and present some alternatives that provide some of the eye-candy he is obviously smitten with. There are some great looking jQuery effects that might "scratch this itch..."

PS: this is a good thread but the subject title is very generic and vague...

Thanks Photowebmax. I’ve been trying to find a full page flip with jquery all day. I think I can sway him but I just needed to reassure myself that I wasn’t missing some secret SEO Flash plugin or something.

Page flips, long dissolves, fancy picture gallery effects and anything that moves or slithers on a page is cute for the first few seconds and then it all becomes very old.

This is sort of like when people want to have music playing on their sites. I hate this and refuse to add it any site I build. Most people find general background music is cheesy. I think some of these page flip effects or sites that try to look like pages in a book are almost in the same category.

I would show the guy some lists of top cutting edge designs and ask him which ones he likes. Smashingmagazine.com and CSSMania.com are good resources for getting clients to look at sites and pick the ones they like. I ask them to make a bookmark file. Its also interesting to have them identity which sites they hate.

Identifying what triggers a favorable or unfavorable response with web sites is hard to express in words. People know it when they see it but its hard to explain...

Maybe your client has seen this website http://www.blogmagazine.net/

Btw with jQuery or Mootools you can make a very cool and good-looking website like this http://pip.io/. I don’t like flash websites because are difficult to update and are not SEO friendly, but I understand your problem. Sometimes is difficult to change the client’s mind. So if he wants to stick with it, you can either make it in flash (if you know how) of refuse the work

My business model is to provide council on the various tenets of building a website properly, but never turn away a client (unless it’s adult services).

If the client insists on a ’page-flip’ flash-based site, I would lay out the pros and cons to give the client the understanding to make an educated decision on which way to proceed. If they continue to insist, fine. Build and deliver the best flash-based site you are capable and collect the fees for your services. They are happy. Your business earned revenue.

Now if they’re making demands and trying to chisel your fees down to your costs, that’s a different story!

- Mike

My business model is to provide council on the various tenets of building a website properly, but never turn away a client (unless it’s adult services).

I agree with you, this might be a option. However, some people are demotivated when they’re asked to build a website that has an uncertain future