Re: Modx Manager UX Working Group

Hi Gabriel,

Thanks for setting this up. By the looks of some of the screenshots, you're also a fellow Canuck!

I don't know to what extent my experience with MODX is common with others, but I think that someone has to start the ball rolling beyond the great introduction to this. I'm definitely interested in the process and helping where I can.

First of all, for me, I'm using MODX to create a web application. A huge one. Anyone reading this can tell me to what extent this fits with their view of the world.

This represents a laundry list of items which I think fit into this discussion.
1) Static Resources are completely different type of object than a document, yet the difference between a chunk and a snippet is merely a checkbox. Why not remove the idea of a static resource as a different type and make it consistent with element types.
2) On Static resources, I see them as a way of being able to edit them outside of the MODX editor, but more importantly, to enable real backups (independent of MODX) and version control like GitHub.
3) In large projects, trying to put something that is shared between two categories into a single one becomes a bit of a problem: replace categories with labels/tags like you see in GMail. Scanning a list of 10 items is a lot easier than trying to go through a list of categories to search
4) Categories (or even better labels/tags) don't apply to Resources but I think they should
5) categories or labels/tags should implicitly have a folder associated with them. When I have 200 chunks, and I add one to the folder structure, it should know which folder I want.
6) even better than 5, simply have the elements at the highest levels mimic the folder structure on the system, so that by copying a file into a certain folder, it has the content, then add in defaults to save it. With a visual cue, show that there are items missing for it to be used
7) get rid of the toolbar in each of resources, elements and files (or have a setting for the same)
8) responsive/mobile first manager: ensure that tasks which make sense to do on mobile can be done on mobile. If there are mobile only tasks, add them too.
9) Workflow for publishing
10) On installation, ask questions as to what is the main purpose of the install: blog, portfolio, learning
11) with learning, use informational scaffolding to start with a minimalist manager and add functionality. This would give new users something clean to look at. Through a series of tutorials, they would learn new things and that functionality would appear.
12) One thing I thought of when I was reading Mobile First was the extreme opposite: with multiple monitors, you could show code on one monitor, and a site which refreshed on the other for things that might be updated in real time.
13) Better layout of security. I've seen a lot of calls for the ACLs to be completely revamped. I myself had a lot of trouble with them until I read Shawn Wilkerson's book and I think that's really how it all jelled for me. Now that I [think I] understand, I don't see a need to change the ACLs in the back end, but rather how they are presented in the front end, without losing the power that they bring
14) make the uberbar capable of not just of searching for things but giving commands like "new document". I have more thoughts to share on this later.
15) User impersonation for testing user rights on systems with external authentication (like Active Directory)
16) make sure it is accessible to those with visual impairments. This might be something to be specified in the install process.

Thanks again for starting this up.

Regards,
Tom

Static Resources are really only half-way implemented. Using the content to contain the path to the file? No support for media sources? At the modxexpo in Germany last fall, when talking to some of the developers responsible for setting up static elements, they were surprised that static resources didn't have the same features as static elements.

I've always thought (and have frequently said) that using templates as a way of categorizing resources was not a good idea. Template Variables actually have nothing to do with templates. Resources should have been given categories, and these extended resource variables should have been connected to resource categories.

14) make the uberbar capable of not just of searching for things but giving commands like "new document". I have more thoughts to share on this later.

vi or emacs?

Hey @timbodrumbo, I just reveiewed the Mandala and wonder if it's worth noting the three primary users are actually not so well defined, there are designers, Front-end developers, developers, site builders, site owners, site admins, content creators, content contributors, content managers, content strategists, content publishers. I'd say the glaring issue for me is that end users are all kinda lumped in, and Designes/FE-Devs are lumped together, often those skillsets are separate but overlapping.

Lots of valid concerns in your sounding board though, many of which we'd like to address in the future of MODX. I personally, have contrary experiences with regard to Revo and clients (non-technical users).

Something, I'd like to avoid is projection, my own and that of each individual projecting our wants and needs onto other stakeholders/users. We sometimes make assumptions about things that drive us crazy and we can sometimes project that to our clients even though they're otherwise oblivious to it. Keep in mind that millions of people love MS Word, the UX is terrible. I hate the UI of windows, but it's fine to others. We like what we know, we like what's the same and we want others to align with our ideas of the world.

Lets ask the questions and do the interviews.

Quote from: sottwell at Feb 14, 2014, 05:12 AM

14) make the uberbar capable of not just of searching for things but giving commands like "new document". I have more thoughts to share on this later.

vi or emacs?

Hi Susan,

Sorry for the late response on this. From a usability point of view, if many people think of a MODX resource as a document, "new document" would do the same as "new resource", which would bring up the "create a new resource" dialog for you.

Regards,
Tom

Quote from: timbodrumbo at Feb 14, 2014, 11:28 AM

A big favour to the group is to get you to articulate your points in a bit more detail. If you want to volunteer to do some work with us, it would be great to start prioritizing and formalizing your ideas into a few wireframes for the stack. We can collaborate.

I would definitely be interested in helping out on this. It looks like my time is going to free up a lot shortly. At some point in time, do we do up Personas and get into User Stories?

Regards,
Tom

It was a busy weekend, but I was able to have a quick scan thru the materials and also installed REVO 2.3 to get an idea of what's coming

------------------------------------------------------------
Some quick Keywords

• Graceful degradation?
• Progressive enhancement?
• Least clicks
• Intuitive use
• Simplicity

Pros 2.3 manager

• Quick commands would be awesome! (from JP's video) Will those be available in 2.3?
• Collapsible sections (not really a new feature in REV, but handy anyway!)

Cons 2.3 manager

• Actions via icons. The manager icons are too small for users with thicker fingers on touch devices & demands a fair amount of dexterity to work with.
  Why not make the icons bigger on small touch screen devices? Clickable Icons can save space and can be intuitive to work with, but they'd have to be bigger & recognizable in its meaning so the corresponding button text can be removed on mobile devices (just to save space).
• Why is the top left search bar growing in size? I'd say; give it a max-width (not wider than the left column) so it scales automatically 'down' as the screen width decreases.

Good example

• Again, this theme/layout is awesome:
  http://pdincubus.github.io/MODX-Revolution-Responsive-Manager-Theme/2/
• I like the placement of sections, menus & buttons.
• I like the alerts tab!

Naming conventions
New resource vs New Document? Is there a difference? Why is it available on multiple spots? Give everything its unique place in the available space, to save space.
Use consistent naming conventions.

Visual
More contrast between blocks/categories/sections to spot locations quicker.

------------------------------------------------------------

That's all that comes to mind for now. I hope there are a few things up in this list that the group can use.

[EDIT]
Oh another thing:

• Why use hover states & effects when they don't work on touch screen devices? Think: "Progressive enhancement".

[/EDIT]

Greets,
J [ed. note: johnsim last edited this post 10 years, 1 month ago.]

Can't help you with the clients part Gabriel. Ironically we work with another CMS @ the office :S I use MODX in for myself in my free time. But I will definitely keep an eye on these threads and help out where I can. If you have any other questions or need opinions, do let me know

This may be more of a UI discussion than UX, but the two are tightly coupled in the MODX manager.

My primary concern with the manager interface is its lack of accessibility to users with various disabilities. I can list specifics, if anyone is interested, but suffice it to say that the experience for users with screen readers, low vision, motor impairments, or cognitive disabilities is far from ideal. In certain cases, users of assistive technologies cannot perform tasks in the manager at all.

I'm from the U.S. so I am specifically worried that the manager does not meet our federal government's "section 508" regulations, nor does it seem to achieve a high rating on the more universal WCAG 2.0 scale. This is a real red flag for any agency or institution that receives money from the federal government, as they have fairly stringent requirements placed not only on the front-end design, but back-end administrative interfaces of software they review.

I suspect that some (most?) of these problems stem from the heavy reliance on ExtJS as the engine that powers the manager UI. Javascript interfaces are not inherently inaccessible: screen readers have made great strides in this area and WIA-ARIA helps quite a bit. It just seems that ExtJS is not currently built with a11y in mind.

As this group continues to brainstorm, I would encourage you to keep accessibility on your list: like a mobile (or markup) first design, it may help bring focus to the discussion and improve the experience for fully-abled users as well.

Quote from: electrickite at Mar 27, 2014, 01:39 PM

My primary concern with the manager interface is its lack of accessibility to users with various disabilities. I can list specifics, if anyone is interested, but suffice it to say that the experience for users with screen readers, low vision, motor impairments, or cognitive disabilities is far from ideal. In certain cases, users of assistive technologies cannot perform tasks in the manager at all.

Hi Corey,

You make a great point. BrigitteB raised the need to have accessible themes in this post here: http://forums.modx.com/thread/87473/high-contrast-theme#dis-post-493591

TLDR: Some in the community have already started down this path and we have a subject matter expert Dan Hart in this area who likes what he sees.

Regards,
Tom